This is one of those shadow boxing christians threads. Yeah, maybe you all look cool in the mirror but they’re going to wake up tomorrow with no idea you insulted their entire belief structure.
Don’t get me wrong. I loved it when my dad asked, “when did you stop being christian” because I vehemently am against his every belief. I loved turning the tables on him and asking the same with regards to everything trump has said and done. End of the day though he’ll just go back to his hidey hole, and myself too.
If you have religious friend you should try it. Call them on trumps shit and the when they invoke god, which they always do, ask, “who’s god” because Jesus doesn’t want this shit.
Oh man! I want that presentation for an Easter dinner I have coming up!
Jesus is looking friendly, but also like he could totally go crazy and flip a money lenders table. It’s hard to tell if he is dafriend or dafoe.
That’s not Jesus, that’s Willem Dafriend.
You know, I’m something of a saint myself
Even better
WWJD?
Get apprehended and sent to a gulag in El Salvador.
It’s funny you mention that because as I was reading the story of Garcia yesterday I couldn’t help but see parallels to the whole back-and-forth that happens to Jesus after His arrest. An innocent man yanked around by an unjust system.
I’m going to say this as a priest ordained in Christ’s One, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church (Episcopal branch): that choice of Jesus image is chef’s kiss
You got me in the first half, but you forgot "evangelical” 😇.
One of my professor, Gérard Siegwalt, a liberal Lutheran, wrote a “Dogmatics for the evangelical catholicity” and I always loved the title.
Signed: an ordained pastor of the Lutheran-Reformed branch.
I don’t know who Colin Bodayle is, but from the responses he got from his students I think he is located in the US. There is rot in the US culture that’s too deep, Trump is just it surfacing. Greed, individualism and selfishness are considered virtues, I noticed it when talking to coworkers there through the years. If Jesus ever went to the US he’d be crucified that is if he wasn’t arrested at the border by ICE for being a Palestinian. The US claims to be a Christian nation, yet it is the furthest from it. What good is your religion if it doesn’t make you do good? What good is your religion if it doesn’t make you overcome your selfishness and greed?
Yeah, it’s the fruit of almost a century of anti-communist propaganda.
If Jesus came to the US he would smack the shit out of all of us
Was Jesus a political man?
Also worth noting that the US is not and never has been a “Christian nation.” Not only did the Founding Fathers specifically separate church and state for that reason, but they also didn’t declare a national religion and enshrined religious freedom as well for that same reason. Plus, half of them were agnostic or atheists. Anybody who says we’re a “Christian nation” is just using religion as an excuse for bigotry.
If God truly exists, he more so loves the atheist who questions the world around him than the Christian who blindly follows.
-Thomas Jefferson
According to the internets, “Liberation Theology” is a Christian movement that started in Latin America in the 1960s, that preaches against oppression. They sound like the opposite of right-wing “Christians”.
Yeah the right wing Christians were training death squads to murder Liberation theology priests in Latin America.
deleted by creator
There’s a “block user” feature that I recommend you make use of. This is a post about Christianity, bringing up Jesus and the fact that he was Palestinian is on topic, it is additionally relevant as Palestinians are being targeted by the US government domestically and abroad.
There are no moral billionaires. Rich men do not enter the Kingdom of Heaven. There are no billionaires in Paradise. In the end, every last one of them burns.
Unfortunately they’re doing their best to burn the rest of us in this life.
They instinctively know where they belong, so they spend their entire lives trying to bring Hell to Earth.
In the end, every last one of them burns.
If there was a just god, they would all burn. But if there was a just god, they wouldn’t get to be billionaires in the first place. Billionaires aren’t worried about hell or the afterlife because most of them know deep down that there will be no repercussions for their unethical behavior.
This line of logic never made sense to me. You could just as easily argue that, as god, the only way to prevent billionaires or people hoarding wealth/resources would be to get rid of free will, and that in a way is also immoral.
Truth.
Also, the predominant image of fire in the Bible is that of purification (not punishment). So the idea is that billionaires (or other such sinners) will not be simply burned away, but will be confronted with what their wealth hoarding has caused. They will have to endure the pain of being rid of their sinfulness in order come out on the other side. So there are no billionaires in Paradise in the sense that every person who is a billionaire in this life will one day be ridden of their wealth in order to enter said Paradise.
This is precisely the image Jesus uses when He speaks of the “eye of the needle.” Tradition holds that this phrase is in reference to a small gate that required a camel (or other pack animal) laden with goods to be unencumbered in order to pass through. The rich must let go of their wealth in order to enter God’s kingdom in the same way because that wealth is like dross to them.
Tradition holds that this phrase is in reference to a small gate
It’s a fake tradition.
Not only a fake tradition, but one started by the wealthy to muddle what was a quite literal saying.
Jesus straight up said that it’s impossible for the wealthy to enter heaven.
We were taught no one ever escapes hell. It’s eternal. No one is purified and comes out the other side ready for heaven.
Good way to keep the ignorant peasants quiet, calm, and obedient.
“It is harder for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven than it is to pass a camel through the eye of a needle.”
It’s amazing to me what logical acrobatics people will go to in order to avoid the simple plain meaning of this passage. The truth is Jesus was a poor person who hung out with other poor people and social rejects of all kinds. He was canonically born in a barn…for Christ’s sake! To me, the message of Christ is quite unambiguous. Rich people go to Hell, same as murderers, rapists, etc. Being rich is a mortal sin. If you hoard enough wealth for a thousand lifetimes, sorry, you’re going to the Pit. There’s no way you can obtain that wealth except through the mass exploitation of the work of others. If you’re a billionaire, and if there is a Hell, you’re going there.
Who says that the bible is morally right?
Christians
Does anyone have that slide deck? Asking for a friend
Relevant quote from St. Basil:
"Who is the covetous man? One for whom plenty is not enough. Who is the defrauder? One who takes away what belongs to everyone. And are not you covetous, are you not a defrauder, when you keep for private use what you were given for distribution? When some one strips a man of his clothes we call him a thief. And one who might clothe the naked and does not—should not he be given the same name?
The bread in your hoard belongs to the hungry; the cloak in your wardrobe belongs to the naked; the shoes you let rot belong to the barefoot; the money in your vaults belongs to the destitute. All you might help and do not—to all these you are doing wrong"
"Then He will also say to those on His left, ‘Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels; for I was hungry, and you gave Me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me nothing to drink; I was a stranger, and you did not invite Me in; naked, and you did not clothe Me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit Me.’
Then they themselves also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not take care of You?’ Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
I have always loved how simply Jesus spells it out.
As a kid, I always felt it was so implausible that the Jews would kill Jesus. Yes he claims to be God, which is a no-no, but how can a message of peace and love be so divisive? As an adult, I’ve come to realize that it’s divisive to people who are angry and filled with hate, to people who hate peace and love. The Pharisees of 30CE are the exact same as most Christians today. If you walked in to some Trump country Baptist church today and flipped over the collection plates and told everyone there they were going to hell because the want to deport immigrants instead of help them, you’d be shot for sure.
you’d be shot for sure
Do you think it’s a coincidence that MLK was only shot once he started speaking out against the rich and unifying the lower class (of all races)? I’m not saying there was a conspiracy (though I wouldn’t rule it out) or that MLK was the second coming or a prophet, but it’s pretty clear he started making the ruling class nervous once he started talking about class war.
It’s always a good time to remind people that MLK’s family proved in civil court that the government killed MLK (either through intent or negligence) to enough of a degree that the judge was convinced and awarded them restitution on the charges. And the only reason that the case didn’t go to a criminal court was because every judge who read the case refused it.
Hell we have a copy of the letter the FBI sent to Dr. King instructing him to kill himself and save them the trouble.
Whoa, TIL about this.
Yeah, but you knew, deep down.
Mario Luigi King
Where I’ve come in regards to the Pharisees is that they were willing to make violent concessions for the sake of a tenuous status quo. Passover was often a flash point of rebellious activity in Jerusalem (which is why Pilate is there in the first place; to keep Jewish people suppressed and to put down any riots or revolutions from would-be messiahs). Violence was not infrequent at the time. And every time there was violence, Rome would take away more freedoms from Jews.
So the Pharisees are put in a position to see Jesus as a potential catalyst for Roman violence. So they figure that if they help hand over another would-be messiah then they can have a quiet Passover. But this mentality winds up being a sort of Leopards-eating-faces situation because Rome destroys Jerusalem a few years later anyway (due to a would-be messiah—just one that the Pharisees thought might be the real deal this time).
I am sending this to all my neo-lib and conservative leaning friends who go to church every day while people are being imprisoned and having their lives and rights taken away.
Yeah but he also said to love each other, and people quickly realized that he was wrong.
And then, one Thursday, nearly two thousand years after one man had been nailed to a tree for saying how great it would be to be nice to people for a change…
Shut up!
Fuck arbitrary value. There, I said it.
Uh, question. How does one put their penis in this? A-asking for a friend…
Just gonna say for those uninitiated, if memory serves right this little comic is from Chick Tracts. Which are fucking wild basically if you can think of an Evangelical bigotry or conspiracy theory they are all fucken in. As for how a bunch of them became memes my money is on The Bible Reloaded, though I think they were already memes before then.
Check out a Tijuana Bible if you want to see some wild shit
That one about roleplaying games alone was destined to be a meme.
Yeah I’m pretty sure that one in particular dates back to either somethingawful or YTMD.
You know, I’m something of a leftist myself.
You never know when some lunatic will come along with a sadistic choice.
And then there was a fire fight! *rapturous dancing*
I don’t know where that candid jesus image is from but it has so much Dicaprio Raising Drink energy that if it hasn’t been memed already then it should
Pretty sure that is Willem Dafoe from The Last Temptation of Christ.
And yeah, it has Buddy Christ energy.
Precisely from the scene where the disciples realize that the water has been changed to wine at the wedding. John looks over at Jesus and sees that image. Jesus also gives a wink iirc. As one devoted to our Savior I feel like that shot absolutely captures what Jesus was like when He walked our earth.
He’s something of a messiah, himself.
I know there were a lot of things about Last Temptation that were very difficult for a lot of people to cope with, but to me the most challenging thing is Willem Defoe as Jesus H. Christ.
All those NY accents among the disciples lol
He is risen.
wink
Ready for that
Christ’s teachings were an inspiration to Marx
Weird how kings re-writing the Bible over and over again for thousands of years got rid of all the good stuff and left all the horrible shit…
I mean, it still has the good stuff. Churches just focus on the parts that blame the working class.
I started going to a progressive church (mainly bc my dad made me lol) and it’s SO INTERESTING learning about how the Bible is literally just the most basic “be nice to each other, you dumbasses” and people will take it and start beating each other over it
A few weeks ago they had the head of the local mosque to talk about Palestine along with an Activist that visited there. It was mainly educational where you could ask questions and stuff.
I personally am not particularly religious in the idea that God personally effects everything but it’s damn neat once you stop nitpicking every little thing like other churches and look with an open mind.
For example, the first depiction of a baptism in the new testament was someone who didn’t fit in the binary man/woman social standards. He (iirc) had his balls removed for religious reasons. The proper ‘old testament’ way of getting baptized wouldn’t let him in, so they went to a river instead. Most churches tell it like this, but you can interpret it as the new testament is open to people outside the social rules (specifically gender) and is saying to accept all.
Probably not 100% accurate as I’m telling a retelling that I forgot part of (thanks, ADHD) but that’s just an example.
I really don’t feel too strongly about religion though. I don’t want to sound like a full Bible supporter in every way, ethics and just being nice are way more important than what an old book says to me.
I was essentially shoved through a normal church and learned to shut it all out as… trans …, but it’s been super cool to learn about how its not what conservatives say it is.A lot of the last half of the New Testament (the books that are “A letter to [the churtch at] <place>” ) spends a decent amount of time on “don’t trust someone just because they say they are holy” and “please stop trying to police other people’s faith and behavior”.
Nothing will make you more frustrated with self-righteous Christians, especially Republican/right-wing christians, than reading the Bible.
Here’s the thing though. A lot of the first two books of the New Testament is about how awful the Jews are and how Jesus was a cult leader who got his followers to abandon their families for him and even got his followers to steal for him. Reading Matthew and Mark in the light of today’s politics, Jesus looks like a right-wing grifter. Seems like they’re reading it right to me.
I love that story about the first New Testament baptismal. It’s so weird to think that that person was (after a fashion) Nonbin. It conjures this weird scene to me where Jesus is in some kind of board room and the Apostles are bringing him polling data.
“Jesus, I know we have a mission statement. I know, I know. “Love thy neighbour” “Love everyone” “We’re all Gods children”. No, totally love that, very cutting edge. No, we’re so onboard. I just think we really need to consider not loving some specific groups. Like, Nonbins, or Trans people, or the Gays. First century Judea is just not very progressive and some of these demographics are…”
Jesus flips whole fucking boardroom table
"What THE FUCK, Paul!? Are we going to have this fight every Dad-damned week? Listen to me. Listen. It’s core to the brand. Do you understand me? The whole brand! We don’t love SOME people. We don’t love JUST the Hebrews, or JUST the Romans. EVERYBODY. If it’s not EVERYBODY, then what the fuck are we doing here? Seriously.
It’s the whole goddamn brand. I promised a “New Way”. You want to take my vision - my divine purpose- and make it just like every other religion on the block. Totally dilute our entire brand image. Why would anyone choose the son of a carpenter, if I was going to be picky? Ok? That’s the core question here. We are doing this for EVERYBODY.
No. No, of course I forgive you. I always forgive you. Just… get the fuck out and lay off the Queers."
You can read Codex Sinaiticus online, it’s from around 400 AD.
The good tidbits are there. The bad was always there. Even early christians thought so.
Before the religion organized into a hierarchical orthodoxy, communities distant from the emerging establishment (not particularly attached to jewish traditions) in places like Alexandria were left to their own devices to figure out christianity: they formed loose households & study circles to interpret texts in the context of their own traditions & culture, and they drew their own conclusions.
- Reading the older jewish scriptures & newer texts quite literally, they concluded there were 2 deities. 1 of whom, the unhidden Demiurge (Yahweh of the old testament) who had created the material universe, was a vengeful and ignorant deity inimical to human welfare. Consequently, material existence is flawed & evil, and they must escape that realm by seeking personal knowledge of the other, hidden deity: the transcendent spiritual entity, the Silent Depth (or the Monad), who briefly inhabited Jesus with that revelatory wisdom or logos found in the newer texts. In other words, there’s cool god (Jesus’s god) & evil genocidal god (Yahweh).
- Moreover, they concluded that church authority isn’t needed: Jesus had awoken a spark of divinity in matter that would find its way back to its transcendent source with little need of episcopal authority or sacramental practice.
This interpretation became known as gnosticism.
Sticklers with the evil trash god of older jewish scriptures didn’t like this idea, became early church authorities, denounced it as heresy, & purged all the texts they could of it. Nonetheless, early christians thought there was bad in those texts & tried to handle it.
