Old trek was super “woke” and optimistic, I see new trek as too focused on war and it paints the future as though they never achieved luxury space communism free of scarcity
At least on that front, it seemed to be rather conditional. If you were not an organic humanoid, you had a much more difficult time.
Just look at Measure of a Man, and what Starfleet later tried to pull with Lal, or what happened on the Sutherland. Or the ExoComps. Or what happened to the deprecated EMH Mk. I units, and the Voyager’s EMH and his holonovel. Or the UGLY BAGS OF MOSTLY WATER crystal aliens. Or the Horta. Or Hugh.
I cannot imagine that the Federation would have ordered the developing a form of memetic virus that would telepathically spread amongst the Klingon population and wipe them all out when they were at war with the Empire.
But they did order it against the Borg, intending to use Hugh as a vector.
In fairness I think the memetic virus was meant to stimulate individualism and perhaps general revolt in the Borg, and Picard and co didn’t think it would result in the collective simply purging entire cubes remotely just to keep the contagion contained. The memetic virus was meant to be the nonlethal option. It turned out to be lethal only because Picard and co underestimated just how ruthlessly it would be crushed. Of course, then again, perhaps I’m misremembering.
In fairness I think the memetic virus was meant to stimulate individualism and perhaps general revolt in the Borg, and Picard and co didn’t think it would result in the collective simply purging entire cubes remotely just to keep the contagion contained
Yes, and it was shown as a huge internal conflict in TNG, and honestly even TOS had a bunch of inconsistent morality that didn’t quite fit a utopian society, you have a lot of state secrets, a lot of espionage, paranoia, and a cold war that includes violating the prime directive on a regular basis as long as they think the Klingons will also violate around the same degree, and that’s really not a very good idea, I really doubt the Vulcans would arm a bronze age civilization on a developing planet with muskets if they thought the Klingons might also do That.
I really doubt the Vulcans would arm a bronze age civilization on a developing planet with muskets if they thought the Klingons might also do That.
If anything, I think that it might be more likely for the Vulcans to do such a thing. Don’t forget that they did interfere with human development a bunch, because they could not readily put them into their existing categories, out of concern for what might happen otherwise.
It does not seem unreasonable that under the same circumstances, they might find it logical to arm a bronze-age civilisation against an alien enemy.
i remember its the reason why the borg even exist, someone mention gene roddenberrry was fighting people that the parasites in that one episode was susceptible to evil and corruption if they are bieng controlled. so they created a borg as a compromise. the episode where the parasites was controlling star trek command and it sent a signal to the delta quadrant, sound familiar just the like borg.
The idea of the borg feel more like “hey, the federation sounds suspiciously like communism that works, can’t we introduce “evil communism” to show how evil it is”?
Sounds probable judging from the stories of the writers fighting Roddenberry’s story mandates. And as soon as he was dead, they did the infiltrating founders anyway on DS9.
that episode was wierd, since everyone thought there was a followup. because they send the big bad signal to the delta quadrant which indicates they were from there about to invade, the queen that was controlling the host had the "map of sectors in the background, which i was taken to say he was sending it there). later replaced by the borg which did the same thing.
At least on that front, it seemed to be rather conditional. If you were not an organic humanoid, you had a much more difficult time.
Just look at Measure of a Man, and what Starfleet later tried to pull with Lal, or what happened on the Sutherland. Or the ExoComps. Or what happened to the deprecated EMH Mk. I units, and the Voyager’s EMH and his holonovel. Or the UGLY BAGS OF MOSTLY WATER crystal aliens. Or the Horta. Or Hugh.
I cannot imagine that the Federation would have ordered the developing a form of memetic virus that would telepathically spread amongst the Klingon population and wipe them all out when they were at war with the Empire.
But they did order it against the Borg, intending to use Hugh as a vector.
In fairness I think the memetic virus was meant to stimulate individualism and perhaps general revolt in the Borg, and Picard and co didn’t think it would result in the collective simply purging entire cubes remotely just to keep the contagion contained. The memetic virus was meant to be the nonlethal option. It turned out to be lethal only because Picard and co underestimated just how ruthlessly it would be crushed. Of course, then again, perhaps I’m misremembering.
No, the virus was meant to exploit a fault in their visual programming to kill the Borg drones and wipe them out. The individuality came as an accidental side effect, when Hugh developed a taste of individuality after losing his connection to the Collective, and roamed around the Enterprise.
When they came to collect, the collective re-assimilated Hugh and also got the individuality he gained, which then led them to explode cubes.
Yes, and it was shown as a huge internal conflict in TNG, and honestly even TOS had a bunch of inconsistent morality that didn’t quite fit a utopian society, you have a lot of state secrets, a lot of espionage, paranoia, and a cold war that includes violating the prime directive on a regular basis as long as they think the Klingons will also violate around the same degree, and that’s really not a very good idea, I really doubt the Vulcans would arm a bronze age civilization on a developing planet with muskets if they thought the Klingons might also do That.
If anything, I think that it might be more likely for the Vulcans to do such a thing. Don’t forget that they did interfere with human development a bunch, because they could not readily put them into their existing categories, out of concern for what might happen otherwise.
It does not seem unreasonable that under the same circumstances, they might find it logical to arm a bronze-age civilisation against an alien enemy.
i remember its the reason why the borg even exist, someone mention gene roddenberrry was fighting people that the parasites in that one episode was susceptible to evil and corruption if they are bieng controlled. so they created a borg as a compromise. the episode where the parasites was controlling star trek command and it sent a signal to the delta quadrant, sound familiar just the like borg.
The idea of the borg feel more like “hey, the federation sounds suspiciously like communism that works, can’t we introduce “evil communism” to show how evil it is”?
i think the parasites were suppose to be the og borg, but gene or someone dint like that idea, that the starfleet can ben controlled by an alien.
Sounds probable judging from the stories of the writers fighting Roddenberry’s story mandates. And as soon as he was dead, they did the infiltrating founders anyway on DS9.
that episode was wierd, since everyone thought there was a followup. because they send the big bad signal to the delta quadrant which indicates they were from there about to invade, the queen that was controlling the host had the "map of sectors in the background, which i was taken to say he was sending it there). later replaced by the borg which did the same thing.