How can you in one breath confirm Kamala wasn’t progressive enough and an the same time claim people did not turn up not because of the lack of appeal to leftist politics? Which is it? It’s the whole argument of this thread. What do you think we’re discussing?
I don’t care what sub I’m in. All I want is leftists to learn to become politically effective. I want leftist objectives to become mainstream. I want to get us out of this endless loop of whining and pandering to virtue signals. I’m going off the starting topic above about how leftists refuse participate in the electoral process because the candidates put forward are not idealistically aligned 100%. This is shortsighted and gets nothing accomplished. These next four years the Overton window will move so far to the right we might as well start over from scratch. It’s one thing to clap all day about progressive values. It’s another process altogether to become politically effective. Some of that requires building coalitions. Doing the groundwork to set up foundations. You know, politics.
All I want is leftists to learn to become politically effective.
So your definition of “politically effective” is to just become liberals?
I want leftist objectives to become mainstream.
I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but the (so-called) “mainstream” exists to co-opt and de-radicalise leftist objectives. The “mainstream” is not funded by Anarchism Inc, you know.
because the candidates put forward are not idealistically aligned 100%.
The candidates put forward are 100% antithetical to leftists objectives. Political parties do not exist to represent the working class and never have. They’re not funded by Anarchist Inc either.
It’s one thing to clap all day about progressive values.
Fuck “progressive” values.
Some of that requires building coalitions.
Coalitions with whom? The very liberals who will sell us out to the fascists as soon as we threaten the power and privilege of their capitalist benefactors?
Yes I’m on my phone on the go. It’s sometimes not easy to type it out as I had in my mind. I think everyone can understand what I intended unless they are brain dead.
Kamala was too centrist for people so they didn’t show up. But two things can be true: leftists generally don’t participate in politics and dnc candidates tend to skew to the middle. Because guess what? Older people show up more to polls.
And also I’m correct, every election is like groundhogs day, like being trapped in a time loop, where leftists go:
“The lesser of two evils is still evil, I’m going to keep my hands clean”.
“Voting doesn’t work, because you can’t fix an inherently flawed system from within the system.”
“Voting is just part of the system of oppression by keeping people complacent from making real changes.”
In my memory this anti-voting/vote boycotting goes back at least to 2000 Bush/Gore.
Now let’s say I’m completely wrong, let’s say I’m crazy and I just made that all up in my head. Let’s say that leftists have always been enthusiastic participators in American democracy, and 2024 was the first ever leftist election boycott.
Now from 2025 to 2028, is the overton window moving left, or right? Will the 2028 election be to the left of 2024, or will 2028 be to the right of 2024?
I’m dead serious willing to bet $500 that 2028 will be to the right of 2024. The overton window is still moving right.
So did my original statement even matter? Either way leftist election boycotts are moving the overton window right, whether it started in 2000, or 2024.
The only question is, how many election boycotts have to fail at doing what leftists want until leftists suddenly become aware they are poking the stick in their own bicycle wheel?
Yes… and you have decided to blame leftists for this instead of the political racketeers who invented and maintains this cyclical pseudo-democratic spectacle itself.
How liberal of you… you, a (supposed) “anti-capitalist.”
You can’t be a liberal and an anti-capitalist, Clyde - you have to decide which you’re going to be.
“Voting doesn’t work, because you can’t fix an inherently flawed system from within the system.”
And they are correct.
“Voting is just part of the system of oppression by keeping people complacent from making real changes.”
And they are still correct.
In my memory this anti-voting/vote boycotting goes back at least to 2000 Bush/Gore.
Nope. It was a thing long before the Russian Revolution, genius - it’s only you liberals that are now finding out how utterly hollow your “liberal democracy” truly is and always have been. Leftists have known that before Marx or Bakunin even went through puberty.
You kinda crashed out and lost the plot, you were claiming that leftists were doing lots of voting up until 2024, but you just confirmed my whole point that leftists did not vote.
This you?
I could have sworn that was you.
I could be wrong, but I get the sense there are a lot of young people on this platform and maybe this is your first experience with election cycles?
I don’t know… how many election cycles has there been since Bush Snr. invaded Panama?
Ok so maybe you’ve been around. How’s the leftist strategy of non participation been working out? Have we moved to closer to our goals?
What “leftist strategy” of non-participation?
Do you really believe the people who stayed away from the US elections last year did so because of some “leftist strategy?”
Get real.
How can you in one breath confirm Kamala wasn’t progressive enough and an the same time claim people did not turn up not because of the lack of appeal to leftist politics? Which is it? It’s the whole argument of this thread. What do you think we’re discussing?
You’re on an anarchist sub, Clyde - nobody here is going to be fooled by politicians peddling edgy liberalism.
Go back and make sure you didn’t lose the plot of the thread at the very start, okay?
I don’t care what sub I’m in. All I want is leftists to learn to become politically effective. I want leftist objectives to become mainstream. I want to get us out of this endless loop of whining and pandering to virtue signals. I’m going off the starting topic above about how leftists refuse participate in the electoral process because the candidates put forward are not idealistically aligned 100%. This is shortsighted and gets nothing accomplished. These next four years the Overton window will move so far to the right we might as well start over from scratch. It’s one thing to clap all day about progressive values. It’s another process altogether to become politically effective. Some of that requires building coalitions. Doing the groundwork to set up foundations. You know, politics.
So your definition of “politically effective” is to just become liberals?
I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but the (so-called) “mainstream” exists to co-opt and de-radicalise leftist objectives. The “mainstream” is not funded by Anarchism Inc, you know.
The candidates put forward are 100% antithetical to leftists objectives. Political parties do not exist to represent the working class and never have. They’re not funded by Anarchist Inc either.
Fuck “progressive” values.
Coalitions with whom? The very liberals who will sell us out to the fascists as soon as we threaten the power and privilege of their capitalist benefactors?
I think you should just read what you wrote. you seem to be able to put the words in the right order, without understanding what they mean.
Yes I’m on my phone on the go. It’s sometimes not easy to type it out as I had in my mind. I think everyone can understand what I intended unless they are brain dead.
Kamala was too centrist for people so they didn’t show up. But two things can be true: leftists generally don’t participate in politics and dnc candidates tend to skew to the middle. Because guess what? Older people show up more to polls.
I’m not a liberal, I’m anti-capitalist.
And also I’m correct, every election is like groundhogs day, like being trapped in a time loop, where leftists go:
“The lesser of two evils is still evil, I’m going to keep my hands clean”.
“Voting doesn’t work, because you can’t fix an inherently flawed system from within the system.”
“Voting is just part of the system of oppression by keeping people complacent from making real changes.”
In my memory this anti-voting/vote boycotting goes back at least to 2000 Bush/Gore.
Now let’s say I’m completely wrong, let’s say I’m crazy and I just made that all up in my head. Let’s say that leftists have always been enthusiastic participators in American democracy, and 2024 was the first ever leftist election boycott.
Now from 2025 to 2028, is the overton window moving left, or right? Will the 2028 election be to the left of 2024, or will 2028 be to the right of 2024?
I’m dead serious willing to bet $500 that 2028 will be to the right of 2024. The overton window is still moving right.
So did my original statement even matter? Either way leftist election boycotts are moving the overton window right, whether it started in 2000, or 2024.
The only question is, how many election boycotts have to fail at doing what leftists want until leftists suddenly become aware they are poking the stick in their own bicycle wheel?
Yes… and you have decided to blame leftists for this instead of the political racketeers who invented and maintains this cyclical pseudo-democratic spectacle itself.
How liberal of you… you, a (supposed) “anti-capitalist.”
You can’t be a liberal and an anti-capitalist, Clyde - you have to decide which you’re going to be.
And they are correct.
And they are still correct.
Nope. It was a thing long before the Russian Revolution, genius - it’s only you liberals that are now finding out how utterly hollow your “liberal democracy” truly is and always have been. Leftists have known that before Marx or Bakunin even went through puberty.
Yes. Let’s.
You kinda crashed out and lost the plot, you were claiming that leftists were doing lots of voting up until 2024, but you just confirmed my whole point that leftists did not vote.
Is that your excuse for blaming leftists instead of the political racketeers who got you into this situation in the first place?
Try harder.