Kamala Harris: Hamas committed horrific acts of sexual violence on Oct. 7
www.haaretz.com
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U.S. Vice President’s remarks come amid allegations from Israel’s critics that claims of sexual and gender-based violence were either fabricated or exaggerated in order to provide justification for its military response in Gaza

Speaking at an event dedicated to raising awareness on conflict-related sexual violence, including the airing of Sheryl Sandberg’s “Screams Before Silence” documentary, “On October 7, Hamas committed horrific acts of sexual violence,” Harris said.

Her remarks come amid steady criticism from Israel’s critics on the left that claims of sexual and gender-based violence were either fabricated or exaggerated in order to provide justification for its military response in Gaza following October 7.

“In the days after October 7, I saw images of bloodied Israeli women abducted,” she continued. “Hamas committed rape and gang rape at the Nova music festival, and women’s bodies were found naked from the waist down, hands tied behind their back and shot in the head.”

  • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOP
    515·
    5 months ago

    You have been informed multiple times that your UN report is not investigative or has any legal implication whereas the one I linked is.

    Furthermore the investigative report very clearly states there is no evidence. Only testimonies. You could have read that in the first line of the image I posted. It appears however you are more interested in pushing a narrative that has already been debunked.

    • FlowVoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
      112·
      5 months ago

      Testimonies are evidence. That’s why prosecutors call witnesses to the stand.

      In fact testimonies are often preferred over non-testimonial evidence, aka “circumstantial evidence”.

      The UN obtained testimonial evidence and circumstantial evidence of sexual violence:

      [We] collected and preserved digital evidence, including images of victims’ bodies displaying indications of sexual violence, a pattern corroborated by independent testimonies from witnesses

        • FlowVoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
          111·
          5 months ago

          That’s completely false.

          the Commission documented cases indicative of sexual violence perpetrated against women and men in and around the Nova festival site, as well as the Nahal Oz military outpost and several kibbutzim, including Kfar Aza, Re’im and Nir Oz. It collected and preserved digital evidence, including images of victims’ bodies displaying indications of sexual violence, a pattern corroborated by independent testimonies from witnesses.

          • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOP
            210·
            5 months ago

            It’s literally written in the UN investigation. It’s highlighted even in the image I posted.

            • FlowVoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
              101·
              5 months ago

              That’s not what they said.

              Read it more closely. This is literally in the same report:

              Based on the information gathered by the mission team from multiple and independent sources, there are reasonable grounds to believe that conflict-related sexual violence occurred during the 7 October attacks

    • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
      91·
      5 months ago

      I know I said I wouldn’t get drawn into the back and forth. I really don’t want to. 🥲

      But I just wanna posit a little thought experiment:

      “Hang on – were you the one sneaking into the shop after hours and fucking the stuffed animals?”

      "There’s no hard evidence of that! Not that exists in a fully accredited legal document! The follow-up report completely discredited the

      I’m still – completely seriously – wanting to know what report you are even citing in these screenshots. Like I say, I found a random .doc somewhere that is clearly a draft version of that same document, but it wasn’t even immediately clear to me what it was or when it was produced. And, why you say it supersedes the SRSG-SVC report instead of the other way around.

      • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOP
        111·
        5 months ago

        You are not legally obligated to defend fake israeli rape accusations against Hamas. You can choose not to copy paste already debunked articles and ripping paragraphs out of context. Yet you seem too entrenched in your beliefs to admit that.

        Instead of objectively looking at the situation from both sides you have made zero effort to ever consider that Hamas did not rape anyone. As if it is an impossible reality.

        • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
          91·
          5 months ago

          Okay, so you don’t feel like revealing where you are getting the screenshots or what that report is. Got it. I was just curious in case I had missed something. Carry on.

          • FlowVoid@lemmy.worldEnglish
            71·
            5 months ago

            The first screenshot is from here

            The second is from here

            If you read both reports instead of cherry-picking quotes out of context, you’ll find they both conclude that Hamas sexually assaulted Israeli women.

            • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
              71·
              5 months ago

              Got it. So it makes sense now – reading it now it looks there were two reports, one with a general overview of war crimes of all types committed by all sides during the conflict, and one much more in depth with a particular focus on sexual violence committed by Hamas. And, of course, there’s not any contradiction between the two or sense in which the one that’s an overview invalidates the one that’s more specific and detailed. E.g. the overview one says among other things (placed in among of course an absolutely massive list of crimes by Israel):

              V. Legal Analysis

              1. The Commission found that acts of sexual violence were committed on 7 October in Israel, including at the Nova festival, on road 232, at Nahal Oz military base and kibbutzim Re’im, Nir Oz and Kfar Aza.

              VI. Conclusions

              1. The Commission identified patterns indicative of sexual violence in several locations and concludes that Israeli women were disproportionally subjected to these crimes. The attack on 7 October enabled perpetrators to commit SGBV and this violence was not isolated but perpetrated in similar ways in several locations and by multiple Palestinian perpetrators. The Commission did not find credible evidence, however, that militants received orders to commit sexual violence and so it was unable to make conclusions on this issue. However, inflammatory language and disbelief around sexual violence, observed with both parties, risks silencing and discrediting survivors, further exacerbating trauma and stigmatization.

              … which agrees in literally every particular with the Patten report, including the conclusions it reached and which conclusions it didn’t reach (or stopped short of or said it wasn’t attempting to analyze.)

              I mean, I wasn’t really in any doubt that what Linkerbaan was saying was a bunch of made up crap, but I am glad to be able to understand the context of the two reports and what actually happened.

          • Linkerbaan@lemmy.worldOP
            16·
            5 months ago

            It’s the UN report detailing israeli and Hamas war crimes. Surely you are able to find a report by typing a sentence of it in google.

            The report does find evidence that israel is systematically raping Palestinians by the way.

            It just can’t find evidence for Hamas raping israelis. Wonder why…