When our daughter was little, we had neighbors with a daughter about the same age, and sometimes the girls would play. Our daughter had been really good all the way around, getting straight A’s in school, being kind, never asking for anything significant, etc., so that year we decided to splurge and get her an American Girl doll for her birthday. If you don’t know, those were dolls that were stupidly expensive and were all the rage in the early 2000s. We weren’t wealthy but it felt like she deserved the splurge and we knew she’d take care of it and have it forever like all her toys (she’s 26 and still has it in great shape).
She loved it and everything was great until the neighbor came over the next day, absolutely livid. He wanted to know why the hell we had to get our daughter an American Girl doll. I was just totally confused, trying to understand what the issue was. He angrily said, “Now we have to buy our daughter one, and we just can’t afford it!” I didn’t know what to say. Were we supposed to ask them what they could afford and only buy our daughter those things?
They bought their daughter two of them so she’d have more than ours did. Ours was really happy that her friend got two of them, and it didn’t even seem to occur to her to want a second one - she liked the one she got.
People are weird.
That is absolutely wild.
Middle-class suburban streets, miles away from farm or forest, full of sparkly clean gargantuan pickup trucks
And they only put groceries in the back seat because the truck bed is “too dirty”
If you never put stuff in the back of your truck because it’s “too dirty”, you absolutely do not need a truck.
Far too many people drive 200% of a truck when they really only need 10% of a truck.
Not talking work trucks or weekend warrior trucks, but specifically trucks that have never seen more off road than the lawn, never hauled a load that took up the whole bed, never towed anything near their rating.
Far far too often, it’s about keeping up with the neighbors truck.
Don’t forget that these owners will be first in line to complain about high gas prices.
I have no idea why this is fun for people. I have one of those giant trucks for pulling my horse trailer. The truck is so fucking hard drive around in traffic. I hate having to commute in it. It is impossible to park at the store. I would never own it if I didn’t have to.
I’ve seen it discussed before and worked with one guy who had a bro dozer. It’s all about image. They complain about high gas prices and expensive repairs, but make any suggestions about downsizing their truck and all of a sudden they defend the truck as a way of life or say the noise is “raw power” or talk about how they’ll someday tow something with it to see what it can do.
They put up with the difficulties in order to look cool.
Mine’s a 2004 F150 and looks like trash. :) I like it that way.
Does it do truck stuff?
It’s gotta be paid off at that age, so maybe it’s a cheaper thing to have that also does what you need out of a vehicle.
Bought it cash a couple of years back. Hurricane beat it up, guy didn’t want to continue working on it.
I beat hell out of that thing. Because it’s a truck, not a status symbol.
It’s not a status symbol of wealth or fake toughness. It is a status symbol of things getting done for cheap, places travelled without so much care, and possibly hard driving.
There was a Miller High Life commercial I used to love. It showed a guy’s hand holding a hose and watering his lawn the “old fashioned way.” Then it showed the neighbor’s brand new SUV in the driveway, and said, “The only ‘off-road action’ this $50,000 monstrosity will ever see if is its owner accidentally backs over a flowed bed,”
Wish I could find that commercial somewhere. Makes me laugh to this day when I see the glorified grocery getters in all their perfectly detailed glory!
I’ve started seeing US pick up trucks here in the UK in a city and they really are rediculous. Really large (comically so) and the truck bit is open to the elements although I have never ever seen anyone using the truck bit for anything whatsoever. Rediculous waste of space and I’m surprised they’re ever legal here.
Hey, maybe they need to be ready to haul full sheets of plywood at any moment
An even better example: the suburbs in general. Every aspect of them.
That reads like a Joni Mitchell lyric.
I mean that in a good way.
And they run on Diesel!
I’m going to go with a slightly unorthodox answer. Phones.
You don’t need a new phone every year. You don’t need a new phone every two years. You don’t even need a phone every three years. Your old Galaxy S7 or iPhone 6 still works. Don’t waste your money keeping up with the latest phone. So what if it has a slightly better camera? What are you taking pictures of? What does it really do that your old phone doesn’t?
Once you properly consider everything you realise that you only really need to upgrade your phone every 4-5 years minimum. Many will last much longer.This is lacking a target. It’s not an example of keeping up with the Jones, it’s just an opinion. A rather wild one in which you judge other’s motivations as invalid.
The whole thing about “keeping up with the Joneses” is inherently about judging others’ motivations as invalid.
WIth a phone, there are various reasons to want a new phone. But you certainly don’t NEED one. The year-over-year improvements have largely become trivial. Mostly, camera upgrades marketed for impressing your peers. In any case, this tendency is certainly based on norms set by the marketing, which people follow. And there is some portion of this that is just conspicuous consumption.
I can’t think of anyone who upgrades their phone other than normal hardware reasons, i.e.; cracked screens, decreased battery performance, etc.
Perhaps your peer group has a higher level of vanity around their phones than normal.
Can you provide a specific of someone you know upgrading their phone because their neighbor did so?
People who complain about others upgrading their phones are actually half a version of keeping up with the joneses.
Spending mental cycles on the possessions of others is the first criteria towards keeping up with the joneses, the second half is the purchase to keep up.
I worked at AT&T and then AT&T for about 8 years. I’m not talking about the anecdotal evidence of personal friends. I’m talking about broader consumer data.
For your information, here’s a statistical study: https://www.statista.com/statistics/619788/average-smartphone-life/
This indicates an average of replacing a phone every ~2.7 years. That means there’s someone that replaces their phone every year for each person who keeps their phone for 4 years. And many people keep them longer than that. Obviously, I’m not saying that EVERYONE does this. But obviously this is not uncommon.
I don’t typically complain about this; it happens to be the topic of conversation here. It just sounds like you’re taking it personally for some reason…
Regarding the camera, I do a lot of backpacking and my phone is my only camera. Upgrading to appreciably better camera tech is something I will do. Example (Pixel 6 phone):
Out of curiosity, what makes you buy another phone instead of buying some entry level photography gear which will undoubtedly give better than a tiny phone sensor?
Is it just the whole “point-and-shoot” thing? Or is it something deeper than that?
For backpacking it’s a matter of having to carry it all with you. Most people will likely bring a phone anyway for safety, so no need to carry a heavy camera on top. Also it’s another thing to keep charged.
And you have to edit almost all of the pictures afterwards since neither DSLRs nor mirrorless cameras have automated post-processing that smartphones have. I’d love to upgrade my small Fujifilm X-T100 with GCam algorithms and I’d F-KING KILL for pairing it with DxO DeepPRIME denoising algorithm. Heck, these two would be fine additions to my Galaxy Note 9! No wonder @CherenkovBlue@iusearchlinux.fyi uses Pixel 6, it’s perfect for a quick snap in good light.
Thanks!
Although not an extreme ultralight backpacker, I follow those principles for what I take with me and I like to move fast in the high mountains. I don’t go to take photos, I go for the experience, but good photos are a plus. I can get some great photos with my phone at this point, though it certainly isn’t the same as a DSLR camera. My phone has my maps for navigation and my books for reading in camp as well. It’s waterproof and resilient and weighs very little. It is extremely convenient for use - put in pocket, take out when needed.
I would love to find a camera that is small, and doesn’t take 20 seconds to boot…
Having never even considered owning a dedicated camera, I’m still somehow offended at the prospective a device that takes 20 seconds to boot. F**k those cameras.
A point-and-shoot film camera might be the way to go, lol.
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Exactly. I use this thing all the time, every damn day.
I consider myself pretty frugal, but it’s a no brainer to budget $1/day so I can get a nice phone every few years.
I feel a similar way. My original comment was about people who get a new phone every year because they want the latest thing just because it’s fancy and new, and how it’s entirely possible (and much more financially logical) to use your current device until it no longer serves your needs. I however neglected to mention the people in the middle, which is where you, I, and many others currently sit. We are in the fortunate position to be able to buy a new phone every few years because we want to, not because we’re under the impression that we need to.
This is arguably the best position to be in, but I may be biased :)
this kinda contradicts your original point. Regardless, phones are a weird exception because many plans subsidize new phones; those getting new phones every year may be doing so because that’s part of how they can afford it
Additionally, even having a 2 year old phone can start limiting you. that’s around the point in time where you’ll start seeing apps no longer supporting some. functionalities on your phone. Phones also are one of the few luxuries many even have access to and they serve a practical purpose.
I’ll try and clarify what I originally meant: I think buying a new phone every few years only for the sake of having a new phone is silly. In my eyes, if your current phone serves your needs then you probably should not buy a new one until that phone no longer does what you need it to do.
However, if you want to buy a new phone but do not need to, that’s fine as long as you are aware of that. The difference lies in the knowledge of necessity.
If, for whatever reason, you need your phone to be up-to-date (e.g. you are a phone reviewer) then that’s understandable. Otherwise, buying a new one is a bit silly.
I hope that helps?
I wait until the battery is no longer useful. Unfortunately, the iPhone makes it difficult at best to DIY a battery change, at worst expensive to have it done officially. Taking care of a battery gets it to about 4 years, and then you’re looking at Apple ending support not too long after that. Decent enough time to switch out phones.
With all my phones the battery and system just start going weird around the 3 year mark. That’s usually when I get a new one.
Yeah, my battery is down to about 4 hours of use. I wish I could just stick with this phone, but I can’t keep up with its charging needs
Keep a phone as long as it gets security updates. A shocking amount of personal info is on your phone and you don’t want it popped
My phone has started glitching a bit over the last month or two. I JUST reached the end of the point out was paid off under my plan, which is kinda suspicious to me.
In there past, I’ve always bought phones outright but this particular one there was a sale where it was cheaper to finance though my provider.
End of billing would be a coincidence.
The phone market has been a lot like the PC market 20, 30 years ago.
Back then, you actually had an advantage by getting a new machine quite often, as the newer machine was so much better and faster than the model from the year before. It actually made a difference for 99% of the users: The text processing, calculating, or browsing programs ran way better and faster on the current model than on the one or two year older one.
Nowadays, any off-the-shelf PC fulfills the needs of 95% of the users. It runs Windows/Word/Excel (or whatever else they use) fast enough to not be an issue. The only people who still need the bleeding edge stuff are some high-end uses e.g. in engineering, and gamers.
Same with cell phones. Ten years ago, the annual new model actually provided a big leap of abilities and comfort. Nowadays, I’m replacing my 5+ year old model just because the battery is getting close to the end of it’s usability.
I felt bad about splurging on a brand new phone after only 4.5 years. But it was a treat to myself.
I had a Nexus 5 that was old enough for my friend to give me for free, and I used that until the battery just wouldn’t hold a charge longer than an hour idling.
The phone I replaced it with had specs that were ever so slightly lower than the Nexus 5.
It was a night and day difference when I replaced that phone with something actually good.
Do I use all the features? No. Should I have waited for a price drop? Probably. Do I regret it? Nah. Probably a once in a lifetime event for me, to allow myself to be excited for the launch of a new phone and to experience that much of a jump in quality.
I hope to get 7 years of life out of this phone even if it means getting the battery replaced (expensive…) and living without the top-of-the-line security updates (unfortunately).
Depending on the popularity of the model, you may continue to get updates through third party efforts such as LineageOS or PostmarketOS.
Good point! And that’d be more than enough to make me feel like I’m getting an “upgrade” if I’m feeling that itch after however many years
Just like a business that’s finally “upgrading” to Windows 7 after being on XP for 10+ years!
I appreciate the comparison, but mobile devices go out of date far faster than desktop OS’s, at least in terms of security updates.
I’m still using Windows 10 and getting security updates for a few more years.
Coincidentally, security updates for my phone and my desktop OS will run out at the same time, despite my desktop OS coming out more than half a decade earlier than my phone.
I suppose it’s just a byproduct of the cellphone boom and how fast things changed. Almost feels locked in by default to upgrade if you started out with a brick phone, flip, camera, then finally smart, and smart phones advanced pretty well for a while, but feels like they’re all the same now, incremental upgrades. But here I’m am still stuck on this ride.
I hear that.
Send from my Android Pixel 12 (not yet released to the public, it’s that advanced).
Yes, but it depends.
We had S8s that were getting noticably slow. We upgraded to S21s when those came out and those are significantly faster and haven’t slowed down.
We use our phones a lot, so significant slow down is noticable and annoying. But our phones are fine right now, so no reason to upgrade.
at the rate my $50 flippers fall apart, i need a new one every couple years or sooner. but i’m certainly not keeping up with anyone wrt my phone… as it’s just a phone, not a pocket pc.
I was more referring to people who buy a new iPhone every year. If your phone does what you need it to do and you replace it when it no longer does that, I think that’s the perfect way :)
Girlfriend’s sister and her husband were essentially homeless. Buying computer equipment and streaming gear they couldn’t afford while living in her parents basement.
Their close friends had a child. Girlfriend’s sister and her husband had a kid to be like their friends. Total disregard that they were living in her parents basement, not to save money or to buy a house, but because they lose their jobs so often they had no other choice.
My mistress insists on having as nice a house as my wife, like wtf?
Move her in!
Apple products.
For most people, yes I agree with you, however apple has done a very good job at creating products for stupid people. If I have someone ask me for advice on phones or computers I always ask them, do you want to have to think to use it? Do you care if you pay more so you can be lazy? If the answer is no to both of those, Apple is not bad. The end user never has to see a file system, everything is drag and drop. My grandmother was able to figure out the Apple UI in about an hour, and that included learning how a mouse and keyboard worked as she had never used a computer before in her life. It’s a little scary how dumb Apple allows you to be.
For that reason and that reason only I think Apple has a place. If you want to get actual work done / don’t want to pay double for the same thing, Apple’s not for you.
I feel like Apple is easier for people who aren’t tech-literate, but actually way harder than Windows/Android for those that are.
I’m one of those millennials who grew up with computers and feels pretty comfortable with technology. I had a near breakdown one night in college when I was in the computer lab trying to edit a video for a project that was due the next day (language class, not tech-related). The file wasn’t exporting correctly and the help staff had gone home for the day so I had to troubleshoot the issue on my own. I was using an Apple computer despite being way more familiar with Windows because it was the only computer with the video editing software I needed installed. I thought perhaps the problem was there wasn’t enough space on the hard drive for the file to export (this was back when all but the most souped-up hard drives had pathetic capacity). It was late at night so there were no help staff available, and I’m about to lose my shit because after twenty minutes of searching I cannot for the life of me figure out how to look up the remaining space available on the hard drive (or any useful info on the hard drive for that matter). Somehow even my typically sharp Google-fu was completely failing me. I don’t even know how many times I instinctually tried right-clicking on that stupid Apple mouse just to be like, oh right, Apple doesn’t even trust their users to have both a left AND right-click button. A few years later I got an iPhone because Android wasn’t a thing yet in the country where I was living (or my provider didn’t support it, I don’t quite remember). It felt like the same situation: what I had access to was easy, but trying to break past the dummy-proofing to do any advanced customization was basically impossible. Frustratingly the thing also started crapping out on me after less than three years, so I replaced it with an android and never looked back.
Epilogue: I’m now a Linux user
In fairness to Apple that is good design. Computers including phones should be intuitive and easy to use, but also accessible to more experienced users.
The keeping up with Jones stuff with apple though is really bad. Like kids going off the university getting premium Mac books when they could save money and get a generic windows lap top. Or the seemingly ubiquitous purchase of earpods - an expensive way to purchase earphones when there are so many cheaper alternatives, not least the dirt cheap 3.5mm wired earphones that phone manufacturers are trying to obliterate.
Yea that part I fully agree with you.
Products for stupid people
I stopped agreeing with that after they added 5 finger gestures.
Another one of you that don’t understand the question and take offense to others preferences. Silliness.
dude i have a 10 years old macbook with bootcamp on it and the thing is working better than wife’s new lenovo thing. the screen is a million times better, and cpu/ram are adequate for zoom calls and excel. finding something with a comparable screen on the PC side is really difficult. when this dies i’ll look for another used macbook like this
My personal favorite is the Christmas decoration wars.
I feel a decoration war would hilariously benefit the neighborhood though.
The resulting lights display is great, but the carbon footprint and the bad blood between neighbors is not.
I have a neighbor that had one of those projecting rotating balls in their yard. It projects Halloween images… it’s still running, no xmas decor in their yard. I’m loving it!!
You might want to go and check in on them?
They’re still alive… unless they became zombies… ???
Thanks, if this was reddit we would have been left wondering…
People who drive trucks to get groceries, bonus points if the truck is lifted
Those are called pavement princess trucks. Trucks that are afraid to touch dirt or mud. If you really want to piss the dude off, refer to it supportively as his gender affirming care.
As someone who has to use them daily since I own a farm…this shit right here has all of us in the construction and farm community pissed…trucks are harder and harder to buy used or buy new with basic shit in them. We’re going to be rough on the truck, give us cloth seats and manual crank windows, no sunroofs and a manual transmission…now trucks are like 100k and have fucking heated seats. It’s insane.
Can someone explain what that slang means?
Living beyond your means to try match the lifestyle or possessions of someone else you envy.
It means when you are trying to look more wealthy/better social status than a neighbor, friend, colleague, ect… Usually though some form of conspicuous consumption.
Thanks for asking for all of us. In Quebec, we call that an inflatable neighbour (translated)
Interesting! What is the non-translated French term?
Voisin gonflable.
Every single aesthetic feature you see anywhere is the result of this.
It’s why we have grass lawns and consider our “fancy” clothes fancy.
Some rich fuck decided to flaunt their wealth and a bunch of dumbass poor people started doing it to
I’m not rich, but decided to flex my landscaping muscle and have the greenest lawn by simply mowing twice per week and not picking up the clippings. The clippings breakdown and provide nitrogen, making a green lawn.
My neighbors have light green lawn and pay a landscaping company…
If you want to get next level green, plant a nitrogen fixing plant, like clover. It won’t directly enrich the soil as it’ll only fix as much nitrogen as it can use itself, but when you mow your lawn and the clover bits biodegrade, that’ll increase your soil’s bioavailable nitrogen content. Decades ago in the UK, it was considered a source of pride to have some clover in your lawn.
I did that to the back yard actually. It’s super green.
Anything to do with iPhones
I was recently able to take my kids on a big trip to California to visit family and take a trip to Disneyland for the first time, and I could really only afford it thanks to the generous financial support from family, especially since everything ended up costing us at least twice as much as we’d budgeted and saved for.
My brother in-law who’s in his 40s recently settled on getting back together with his ex-wife after lots of disastrous relationships (and their relationship was very disastrous too) and he’s constantly getting bailed out by his mother on basic household expenses due to constant impressively bad short term financial planning. He works at a factory making decent enough money which he could live off of with some basic budgeting (aka not spending literally all of his income on tattoos, piercings, music and alcohol) and his ex-wife who has her own host of issues works at a fast-food restaurant.
They told us that they’re going to take their kids to Disneyland in California next summer, and also tried to test the waters for inviting themselves to stay with my family. I suppose they can’t get much worse off financially than they already are so I should be happy for their kids of they manage to pull it off, but holy crap was it an obvious attenpt to one-up us
I have two brothers-in-law that also did that, so…
My view point on this is probably not mainstream but I don’t mind having debt now for vacations. I used to worry so much about debt and I would never go on expensive trips. I would try to save for them but its hard because something always came up. As a result we never went anywhere. I got sick of that and tried getting a credit card for trips and we have gone to a bunch of places and it’s been awesome. I just pay it back the best I can before the next trip. If I were to wait until I had money to go places we would never go and my children would miss out on different cultural experiences. I’m totally ok with debt that makes my children more well rounded people. Also money is just made up. Some people get more than they will ever need when they are first born while others have to struggle for no good reason. Just try to live the best life you can and don’t worry about that shit lol.
Christmas lights. Everyone needing a bigger or better display, or needing to put something out when they can’t afford the electric bills. Folks feeling the need to put out something because the people around them are.
I hear that. We are mostly lazy, so I have never hung up lights outside.
I haven’t actually seen it, but I hear this was pretty awful.
