Last detail: Proper funding for extra policing, to handle the natural difficulties in transitioning a whole bunch of people to a more structured lifestyle all at once, in the same small geographical area.
Otherwise we’ll run into the same problems we did last time we tried block housing, leading to “the projects”. I mean, think about it. That’s a fantastic market for a drug dealer or a gang otherwise, that many vulnerable people all in one place.
Extra policing was part of the problem that led to the gangs. Extra policing targeted at an outgroup means every issue big or small is met with violence and imprisonment. The paternalistic overuse of the criminal justice system leads to the people losing trust in police and in the system. They still need someone to provide community structure, to settle disputes, and to offer some degree of protection and gangs are the homegrown solution to fulfilling that need. Extra social workers and community organizers that are from that community would do a lot better than extra police.
People don’t invite gangs to fill a need. Nor do they have the power to resist gangs when they want to take over. They fill a power vacuum. So, rather than eliminate the need for power to exist, you can also just prevent the vacuum. It’s much more feasible.
But either approach. So long as gangs and drugs are successfully kept away, that is the important part. At least keep the dealers out of the buildings when they try to worm their way in.
True. But once established they become an organism of sorts. It can move, find new prey, etc. It can create the misery it needs to have an environment it thrives in.
It’s a chicken or egg problem, and the answer is unfortunately irrelevant. Now that they exist as independent powers, they no longer need anything to cause them, exterior of themselves. They become self-sufficient.
Extra policing would be fine if the problems with police departments were addressed. Without addressing that whole mess, though, throwing more police officers won’t solve that problem.
Not policing, extra services from non-violent professionals that know how to address issues with homelessness in a way that does not involve tasers and physical assault.
Very true and these police should be trained and continually educated on how to deal with and identify mental health episodes. A lot of people hate police as do I, but I truly believe with proper oversight and education they can be a great asset to our society.
Or just rely more on social workers who actually have that education. And less on people with guns who have a history of authoritarian abuses and state sanctioned violence that can be triggering, especially for people with mental illness.
I love how the original idea for police was “Wow, we should really have some form of enforcing the law that isn’t dependent on local prejudices or just government men trained only to shoot people”, and now it’s… well…
Whose original idea for police? Sounds like maybe you’re alluding to Robert Peel. But as far as I know, the intellectual heritage of American police is more of an extension of runaway slave patrols.
Peel. I could get into a broader argument about the institutional origins of American police, but I think it suffices to say that American police were, at least in terms of becoming formalized structures, influenced by British (and French) policing ideals of the early-mid-19th century.
In that sense, they’ve certainly not lived up to the purported ideals.
Last detail: Proper funding for extra policing, to handle the natural difficulties in transitioning a whole bunch of people to a more structured lifestyle all at once, in the same small geographical area.
Otherwise we’ll run into the same problems we did last time we tried block housing, leading to “the projects”. I mean, think about it. That’s a fantastic market for a drug dealer or a gang otherwise, that many vulnerable people all in one place.
Extra policing was part of the problem that led to the gangs. Extra policing targeted at an outgroup means every issue big or small is met with violence and imprisonment. The paternalistic overuse of the criminal justice system leads to the people losing trust in police and in the system. They still need someone to provide community structure, to settle disputes, and to offer some degree of protection and gangs are the homegrown solution to fulfilling that need. Extra social workers and community organizers that are from that community would do a lot better than extra police.
People don’t invite gangs to fill a need. Nor do they have the power to resist gangs when they want to take over. They fill a power vacuum. So, rather than eliminate the need for power to exist, you can also just prevent the vacuum. It’s much more feasible.
But either approach. So long as gangs and drugs are successfully kept away, that is the important part. At least keep the dealers out of the buildings when they try to worm their way in.
Gangs don’t need an invitation; they need members, and people do join gangs to fill a need.
True. But once established they become an organism of sorts. It can move, find new prey, etc. It can create the misery it needs to have an environment it thrives in.
It’s a chicken or egg problem, and the answer is unfortunately irrelevant. Now that they exist as independent powers, they no longer need anything to cause them, exterior of themselves. They become self-sufficient.
Extra policing would be fine if the problems with police departments were addressed. Without addressing that whole mess, though, throwing more police officers won’t solve that problem.
Not policing, extra services from non-violent professionals that know how to address issues with homelessness in a way that does not involve tasers and physical assault.
Very true and these police should be trained and continually educated on how to deal with and identify mental health episodes. A lot of people hate police as do I, but I truly believe with proper oversight and education they can be a great asset to our society.
Or just rely more on social workers who actually have that education. And less on people with guns who have a history of authoritarian abuses and state sanctioned violence that can be triggering, especially for people with mental illness.
Why not have both be trained? Doesn’t hurt I feel
I love how the original idea for police was “Wow, we should really have some form of enforcing the law that isn’t dependent on local prejudices or just government men trained only to shoot people”, and now it’s… well…
Whose original idea for police? Sounds like maybe you’re alluding to Robert Peel. But as far as I know, the intellectual heritage of American police is more of an extension of runaway slave patrols.
Peel. I could get into a broader argument about the institutional origins of American police, but I think it suffices to say that American police were, at least in terms of becoming formalized structures, influenced by British (and French) policing ideals of the early-mid-19th century.
In that sense, they’ve certainly not lived up to the purported ideals.
the original idea was to make the KKK be on the state payroll