Do tell… WHAT “fundamental military issue of anarchism” have you managed to “identify,” eh?
Did you read the next sentence? No one is going to vote to go on the offensive except zealots. Yeah you had durrutti leading an offensive at the beginning of the war but that was full of literal die hards committed to the cause. Once they are all dead you need to conscript, you need to give top down orders, you need to requisition supplies from civilians, which are all anathema to anarchist ideology. Everyone but hardcore partisans aren’t going to volunteer and even if they do they aren’t going to vote to risk there lives further by going on the offensive. You see this in every case of a democratic military, once the initial wave of zeal wears off they start to hunker down and go on defense. You see it in the Paris commune, black Ukraine and Barcelona.
What are these 2 constant factors if not for the inability to take initiative? And why are these factors not present in other revolutionary movements that were able to succeed like the bolsheviks in 1917? They too had no foreign aid, and the near entirety of the domestic political establishment against them.
Do you think any criticism of anarchism makes someone a tanky? That just seems like the same follow the party line logic that we criticize actual tankies for. I could go on and on extolling the virtues and beauty of the system in Barcelona and condemning the multiple atrocities and failures of the communists but as soon as I suggest democratic militaries don’t work I become a tankie?
Yes I did. Garbage in, garbage out - just like everything else you’ve spawned here so far.
No one is going to vote to go on the offensive except zealots.
It’s difficult for you to understand anyone risking their lives without a commissar standing behind them with a gun pointed at their head.
That tracks perfectly.
I guess tankies truly don’t understand anything other than brutally press-ganging the working-class into building your backwards and bloodthirsty “worker’s utopia” for you, eh?
full of literal die hards committed to the cause.
Right, right… when your bullshit take gets demolished by actual history you explain it away as “die-hard-ism.”
Do you tankies ever fucking listen to the bullcrap emanating out of your own holes?
Everyone but hardcore partisans aren’t going to volunteer and even if they do they aren’t going to vote to risk there lives further by going on the offensive.
Oh, look… here comes the military expertise you gained by playing “Civilization” games again. Remember what I told you about getting your education from video games?
You see this in every case of a democratic military,
Oh really? I guess the Makhnovists decisively defeating a logistically and numerically superior PROFESSIONAL military force at the Battle of Perehonivka and pursuing this brouted enemy all the way back to the Crimea while the press-ganged and (supposedly) “disciplined” Bolshevik goons squads could manage little more than terrorising unarmed Ukrainian peasants is an example of anarchist militaries “hunkering on the defensive.”
Blow it out of your ass.
in other revolutionary movements that were able to succeed like the bolsheviks in 1917?
Such as? The Spartacist Uprising, perhaps? Much succesful, that one. The Cuban Revolution, perhaps? You know, the very same Cuban Revolution that had the benefit of being logistically supported by the newly-minted CIA while the Batista regime was placed under an arms embargo? The anarchists of Ukraine and Spain would have LOVED that level of “non-aid.”
What examples of “unsupported” movements do you have?
Do you think any criticism of anarchism makes someone a tanky?
Again… why would an (alleged) “non-tankie” be peddling cartoonish tankie propaganda?
Why are you so hostile? Every other “refutation” your giving is half name calling and half obscenities.
EDIT: looking at your post history it seems your this way to nearly everyone. Your a combative entrenched ideologue who is convinced they know everything and anyone who disagrees is an idiot. Usually see this in tankies but I guess anarchists can be convinced of the infallibility of there ideology as well. I’d recommend reading some zizek and examining your relationship to your ideology. Any way just going to block you now since you seem opposed to any constructive conversation.
It’s difficult for you to understand anyone risking their lives without a commissar standing behind them with a gun pointed at their head.
It’s not for me, I recognize that there are committed partisans who will risk there lives for the cause, you seem to be, or at least claim to be, one of them. If you are, I recommend volunteering to defend rojava, they look like the sdf could use you about now and they’re probably the closest thing we have to barcelona on this planet right now. I’m saying that’s not most people. There were tons of people volunteering to fight the fascists in WWII but they were not the majority of troops, a majority were drafted, because if the allies stuck to an only volunteer force they would’ve lost. Is it difficult for you to understand that most people, even if you explain it to them well, aren’t going to want to die for anarchism or any sort of ideology for that matter? If you don’t you really need to touch grass.
Oh, look… here comes the military expertise you gained by playing “Civilization” games again.
Idk where you are getting this from, seems sort of a projection since you keep bringing it up and are the one using video game terms like “spawn”.
What examples of “unsupported” movements do you have?
There’s one literally in the sentence you quoted, the October revolution. The allies flooded aid to anyone opposing the bolsheviks, the right, liberals and a lot of the Socialists opposed them, the best they got was a temporary de facto ceasefire from the central powers. Against all this they won the civil war, i wish they hadn’t, but they did.
Even the original modern revolution, the French revolution succeeded for a while despite every nation in Europe opposing them and was only taken down by napoleon’s ego. They didn’t do all this by relying on a democratic all volunteer force, they did it with the levee en mass and a top down military hierarchy.
Did you read the next sentence? No one is going to vote to go on the offensive except zealots. Yeah you had durrutti leading an offensive at the beginning of the war but that was full of literal die hards committed to the cause. Once they are all dead you need to conscript, you need to give top down orders, you need to requisition supplies from civilians, which are all anathema to anarchist ideology. Everyone but hardcore partisans aren’t going to volunteer and even if they do they aren’t going to vote to risk there lives further by going on the offensive. You see this in every case of a democratic military, once the initial wave of zeal wears off they start to hunker down and go on defense. You see it in the Paris commune, black Ukraine and Barcelona.
What are these 2 constant factors if not for the inability to take initiative? And why are these factors not present in other revolutionary movements that were able to succeed like the bolsheviks in 1917? They too had no foreign aid, and the near entirety of the domestic political establishment against them.
Do you think any criticism of anarchism makes someone a tanky? That just seems like the same follow the party line logic that we criticize actual tankies for. I could go on and on extolling the virtues and beauty of the system in Barcelona and condemning the multiple atrocities and failures of the communists but as soon as I suggest democratic militaries don’t work I become a tankie?
Yes I did. Garbage in, garbage out - just like everything else you’ve spawned here so far.
It’s difficult for you to understand anyone risking their lives without a commissar standing behind them with a gun pointed at their head.
That tracks perfectly.
I guess tankies truly don’t understand anything other than brutally press-ganging the working-class into building your backwards and bloodthirsty “worker’s utopia” for you, eh?
Right, right… when your bullshit take gets demolished by actual history you explain it away as “die-hard-ism.”
Do you tankies ever fucking listen to the bullcrap emanating out of your own holes?
Oh, look… here comes the military expertise you gained by playing “Civilization” games again. Remember what I told you about getting your education from video games?
Oh really? I guess the Makhnovists decisively defeating a logistically and numerically superior PROFESSIONAL military force at the Battle of Perehonivka and pursuing this brouted enemy all the way back to the Crimea while the press-ganged and (supposedly) “disciplined” Bolshevik goons squads could manage little more than terrorising unarmed Ukrainian peasants is an example of anarchist militaries “hunkering on the defensive.”
Blow it out of your ass.
Such as? The Spartacist Uprising, perhaps? Much succesful, that one. The Cuban Revolution, perhaps? You know, the very same Cuban Revolution that had the benefit of being logistically supported by the newly-minted CIA while the Batista regime was placed under an arms embargo? The anarchists of Ukraine and Spain would have LOVED that level of “non-aid.”
What examples of “unsupported” movements do you have?
Again… why would an (alleged) “non-tankie” be peddling cartoonish tankie propaganda?
Why are you so hostile? Every other “refutation” your giving is half name calling and half obscenities.
EDIT: looking at your post history it seems your this way to nearly everyone. Your a combative entrenched ideologue who is convinced they know everything and anyone who disagrees is an idiot. Usually see this in tankies but I guess anarchists can be convinced of the infallibility of there ideology as well. I’d recommend reading some zizek and examining your relationship to your ideology. Any way just going to block you now since you seem opposed to any constructive conversation.
It’s not for me, I recognize that there are committed partisans who will risk there lives for the cause, you seem to be, or at least claim to be, one of them. If you are, I recommend volunteering to defend rojava, they look like the sdf could use you about now and they’re probably the closest thing we have to barcelona on this planet right now. I’m saying that’s not most people. There were tons of people volunteering to fight the fascists in WWII but they were not the majority of troops, a majority were drafted, because if the allies stuck to an only volunteer force they would’ve lost. Is it difficult for you to understand that most people, even if you explain it to them well, aren’t going to want to die for anarchism or any sort of ideology for that matter? If you don’t you really need to touch grass.
Idk where you are getting this from, seems sort of a projection since you keep bringing it up and are the one using video game terms like “spawn”.
There’s one literally in the sentence you quoted, the October revolution. The allies flooded aid to anyone opposing the bolsheviks, the right, liberals and a lot of the Socialists opposed them, the best they got was a temporary de facto ceasefire from the central powers. Against all this they won the civil war, i wish they hadn’t, but they did.
Even the original modern revolution, the French revolution succeeded for a while despite every nation in Europe opposing them and was only taken down by napoleon’s ego. They didn’t do all this by relying on a democratic all volunteer force, they did it with the levee en mass and a top down military hierarchy.
Oh, look… another tankie that pretends to not understand the hostility you so richly deserve.
Run, tankie. Run.